Tag Archives: marketing

Jackman Reinvents

Joe Jackman Reinvents How Brands Embrace Change



Not many people – or brands — love change as much as Joe Jackman. The CEO of Jackman Reinvents has been a valued advisor to major retailers like Staples and brands like Flow Water, to B2B companies and to private equity partners. In this episode hear how he uses insights about trends and human behavior to drive change – or reinvention – and why that’s essential for a brand today.
Jackman believes that moving from town to town as a kid with his retail exec dad emboldened him and taught him relationship skills. To the envy of any who have experienced “imposter complex,” Jackman has confidently embraced change professionally, moving from creative to CMO to CEO, admittedly making it up as he went along at many of the stops along the way. Learn what’s needed for companies to thrive, and the consequences for those that choose to emulate ostriches.
This 40-minute conversation is filled with insights – or, as Jackman calls them when working with clients, “nuggets you can actually hang a strategy off.”
I encourage a full listen, but here are some unmissable elements and Jackman Takeaways:
  • Change has been coming fast and furious for many years, but the pandemic has compressed the need for speed to do things differently now; not just in people’s lives, but in the dynamics of the marketplace
 Jackman Takeaway: If you’re not changing and evolving, you’re stuck. That would probably be the best scenario. But the more common scenario is you’re moving backwards or, in business terms, you’re waning or dying.”
  • Joe Jackman explained his personal path and how an appreciation of change took him from creative director to business owner after stints helping launch brands like Joe Fresh (no relation!).
 Jackman Takeaway: “I said, why can’t I be a brand strategist? What do I need to know? Who do I need to learn from? And then, eventually, I just thought, ‘Why can’t I shape strategy at the very highest level?”
  • That attitude led to becoming a “reinventionist” – and the definition thereof:
Jackman Takeaway: “It’s a word I made up, but basically the definition is to just be really good at making change happen and to great benefit. The world needs more people with the skills and in the mindset of making change.”
  • Learn which immutable law of marketing he adopted from Al Ries and Jack Trout and built his agency on.
  • Jackman’s concept of reinvention is tied to “invention,” and a brand’s transformation is intrinsically tied to its DNA.
  • We need to collectively “reposition the entire idea of change in our minds as a positive force, and essential. It should be seen as creating the next best, most powerful and relevant version of you or your company.” (He literally wrote the book on this: “Reinventionist Mindset”with a set of five principles for change.)
  • The status quo – especially when paired with success — is a killer. Business model life cycles, executives’ tenures, the length of brands’ relevance, are all compressing. So, since “the future arrives daily,” brands need to figure out step-by-step how to evolve and “get pro athlete good at it or you have it done to you.”
  • Learn how Jackman helped Staples create trial stores that were hybrid workspace meets product sampling; and transformed Rexall, including being the first drugstore in Canada to start offering flu shots.
Jackman Takeaway on Retail: “In a world of choice, which is what the internet did to retail, retail was relatively slow to adapt…. There are exceptions, but retail generally sat and was lacking innovation… A lot of disruption was enabled by that sense of ‘oh, maybe one day we’ll evolve, but stores are the thing now…’. If retail leadership was prescient in reading what’s happening, Amazon wouldn’t exist. Casper wouldn’t exist. Netflix wouldn’t exist and there’d be a streaming service called Blockbuster.”
Big Jackman Takeaway: “There’s probably only one rule in all of this work in transformation: That you must deeply understand who your customers are and what they care about most. …beyond function, into the world of emotion. Most marketers focus on the means. Understand what the end is.”
  • Jackman gives his definition of a brand and why adopting that helps drive trust.
Jackman Takeaway: A brand equals purpose elevated to experience, delivered consistently. Most companies haven’t got that very well defined, and, and yet, if you look at the evidence, purpose led companies tend to outperform their peers.”
  • Cohesive messaging and linkage between ideas and all advertising is essential to continue the brand message.
  • It takes balance and a strong foundation to leverage both brand awareness and demand marketing (and he explains how it relates to dating!)
 Jackman Takeaway: “Performance marketing today is important — because it’s data centric and it’s measurable and we can adjust it — …as long as it ladders up to a higher order of purpose. If there’s no red thread that links to that, that’s not good. You can’t build trust. …And today’s measure of success is if I truly have a relationship with the brand.”

  • Trust, and being in a Values Economy is greatly affecting brands right now.
  • Sustainability and similar values are amplified more now in our pandemic context and impact how consumers make purchase decisions…There’s a lot of de-selection going on today.”
  • Jackman also explains the only two consumer choice tiebreakers

 

 Jackman Takeaway: “I’ve helped well north of 50 companies, and along the way I noticed we’re wired as humans to behave in certain ways. One of the things we don’t love is change. … But I observed ways of thinking and doing that enabled success to come faster… I got them down to five. … For example, the first one is ‘seek insight everywhere’.”
  • Learn to understand cultural currency and even reinvent the old marketing maxim of: ‘I need to pay attention to the customers that I do the most business with.’ (Hint: that’s fine, but you also “don’t want to be a brand or a business that’s like a great aunt: you know, fondly thought of, but never visited.” [That hit a little close to home for this host! Just sayin’.] So, learn to have relevant conversations with the up and coming set of customers [and with, note to self, the nieces and nephews.]
  • Understand how DEI dovetails with cultural relevance and brand values…  and what Jackman would change most about our world. (Note: Hat tip: Maryam Banikarim)
Finally, what brand would Jackman reinvent next?

“What do I want to reinvent? The next company that interests me or has lost its way. And there’s so much of that. How wonderful to spend a career on just figuring out the next act of whatever! And, since climate change is real, and we have to start to make a real difference, those are the kinds of opportunities I’m gravitating towards now. And I’m super excited to be at least part of the solution as best I can.”

If you found this helpful, please consider supporting this ad-free podcast with a small donation (“Buy me a Coffee!”) at https://www.buymeacoffee.com/mossappeal AND please share with others in marketing and business…and even add a review  on Apple, or wherever you like to listen!
Find Jackman Reinvents at: https://www.jackmanreinvents.com
On Insta: https://www.instagram.com/wearejackman/
Find Joe Jackman, his book and podcast at: https://www.joejackman.com/
Please follow E.B. Moss and Insider Interviews on:

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And – if I can help you build or enhance a podcast for YOUR business, please reach out at podcasts@mossappeal.com !

E.B.

 


Warner Bros.’ Shaleen Desai is Very Animated About Good Storytelling



Shaleen Desai is like a caped crusader for content. This SVP of Adult Animation is super focused on solid stories and shares how he is bringing super heroes and more to animation…and beyond. In his career of 20+ years and counting in Hollywood, Desai has been with Letterman, Viacom/CMT, Fox 21 and gone from working with Jason Bateman at Aggregate to Warner Bros. on “Batman” and other IP. Overall, whether it’s animated or audio his focus is making sure Warner Brothers Animation products will resonate anywhere as just good storytelling!
While Insider Interviews listeners heard from Desai in Epi 33 – which was taken from his NATPE ContentCast panel about crossover IP — in this episode 36  Desai gets the chance to go more in-depth around how Warner Bros. Animation and Blue Ribbon Content work with the overall organization to tap top talent — from development to writers to the stars behind the mics. For example, when you hear those words, “I’m

Batman” in a forthcoming scripted podcast it might be spoken seriously by Winston Duke on Spotify… or by a campier Jeffrey Wright in a version called Batman the Audio Adventures on HBO Max. [Since this recording earlier in September it was announced that The Audio Adventures will launch on 9/18 — which is (who knew?!) “Batman Day“!] And of course, there’s always animation, with Batman, Caped Crusader headed to Cartoon Network and HBO Max soon.

But Desai is focused on more than super heroes. He’s also developing new approaches to content, dabbling in AI and more short digital films and podcasts through Blue Ribbon, and always working to just identify the next good story that can live, well, anywhere!
  • Want to know exactly how the pandemic shifted content consumption of more adult animation?
  • How do they pick which story might live as a cartoon or a podcast?
  • Will it land on Adult Swim or HBO Max …or even Spotify or Freeform?
  • Will Desai hire E.B. for voice work!? And why DO E.B.’s doormen call her “Batgirl”?
Learn all this and more from this Hollywood vet and the voiceover wannabe host of this episode.
Please find Shaleen on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/shaleen-desai-aa661412/
Please follow E.B. Moss and Insider Interviews on:

Twitter:
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If you found this helpful, or liked any of my Insider Interviews episodes, please add a review  on Apple, share this episode, and of course to support this show you can “buy me a coffee!”: https://buymeacoffee.com/mossappeal
If I can help you connect YOUR podcast/tv/content dots, or just get started with a good #b2b podcast, please reach out to me at podcasts@mossappeal.com


Ruth Stevens: No BS About B2B Marketing



Today’s episode could be a lesson plan about B2B Marketing because my guest, Ruth Stevens, has been teaching business to business marketing at NYU, Columbia, and B-schools around the world. And that’s in between being one of the foremost consultants in the space. So, Stevens calls BS on certain approaches to B2B we all better sit up and listen. Hear about the “fails” AND the best practices for what makes customers sit up and listen, too!

Stevens went right from business school herself to TimeWarner’s Book of the Month division, “thinking that I was joining one of the great book marketing companies in the world. I learned I was actually in one of the great direct marketing companies in the world.” After seven years of getting schooled in DM she mastered B2B first at Ziff Davis then IBM, simultaneously writing columns as well as teaching others at night.

In one example of her “no BS advice” articles, which appear everywhere from Biznology.com to HBR.org, Stevens says, “Don’t Be a Jerk on LinkedIn”, and advises sellers everywhere not to jump to the pitch. (“Building relationships on social media is hard. People get lazy and go straight to being the seller, and skip the personal establishment part. They’re also just sorely tempted by how easy it is to just make a mass pitch using LinkedIn Sales Navigator.”)

And, heed Stevens when she notes:

Today the ability of the salesperson to guide a purchase in their direction, but also to understand more deeply the needs of the buyer, has been eroded. So the marketer needs to step in and provide the educational content. This has driven the huge rise of B2B content marketing to allow that researcher better understanding of how to solve a problem or how your solution can be helpful, and to guide them toward calling you.

Companies’ approach to client retention is also in need of schooling:

Another area where I see B2B companies failing, or sub-optimizing, is retention marketing and it just drives me crazy because this is where the bulk of profits arise. Most companies organize it to be the responsibility of someone called ‘account management’, which is an important function, but marketing is not being asked to support it.

Stevens feels for the challenges faced by marketers and sellers these days in getting to know or reach know the buyer and ever-expanding buying groups — especially in enterprise purchasing:

Marketers need to try to replicate that old relationship building aspect by identifying the members of the buying circle and either find out through outbound calling, for example, or social listening, or infer what their agendas are, because each member of the buying circle usually has a different agenda, different need. And then try to serve those needs on a one-to-one basis. And despite all of our wonderful MarTech and data, it’s really hard to do.

That’s also why events (especially virtual events) have taken on an even larger role — as a place researchers can get their questions answered. So, Stevens points out, we need to be even more active at business events than before, and to create our own opportunities, webinars and meetings to build those now more elusive business and sales relationships.

The trick there, as with everywhere, as you’ll hear in this episode, is how one shows up at those events or in that content. No pants on a Zoom aside, business presence still needs panache and empathy.

You’ll hear many tips and lessons from “Professor Stevens” in this episode, including:
  • How creative still needs to be about education, but in a context that captures attention and builds trust.
  • How and why we stumble when we try to apply traditional consumer creative strategies to B2B and risk sounding “tinny or irrelevant” — but why storytelling is still a “watchword” for B2B.
  • Why it’s wrong for the brand power to be measured by if it helps the salesperson get a meeting: “Asking marketers to base their entire value proposition to the firm on sales results unfairly puts the sales piece of the puzzle into the marketer’s metrics kit. If the marketers are handing good quality leads and generating interest and a perception of value in the marketplace, and the sales team can’t close the deal, then marketing shouldn’t be taking the hit for that… We need other metrics to help marketers understand what they’re delivering and help management.”
  • And, since Stevens also wrote the book on data-driven marketing (literally) she suggests looking at such metrics as cost per lead, or cost for qualified lead. While lead-to-sales conversion rate shouldn’t be marketing’s, “we need an awareness metric. Or maybe a trust metric, that can credit marketing with all of the earlier pre-lead stuff.”
  • Why the goal of B2B marketing is to communicate that “We are experts in the problem that you have, and you can trust us to help you solve the problem”, but needs to get that across without saying as much and still creating an emotional connection even though you’re buying for business purposes.”

Hey, her words, not mine, but: “this is why the B2B agency function exists in the world because they know what they’re doing and they can come up with messaging strategies that grab attention and deliver the message and in a way that makes sense to the business buyer.”

Finally, as I’m also Editor of The Continuum, a publication about brand and demand marketing, I had to ask if there’s a difference in awareness and performance marketing for B2B vs. B2C. The professorial answer?

“No, it’s the same concept: you need brand and demand for both B2B and B2C, but down on the ground, we’re talking about a very different buying process: B2B is more complicated. It’s longer. It involves more individuals, all of whom have to be engaged with and influenced… such as when it comes to raw materials, professional services, technology, and other business process oriented purchasing, which typically involve a large number of people. So the whole sales and marketing function needs to support that.”

Please find and follow Ruth Stevens for B2B help without the BS:

LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/ruthstevens

Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/RuthPStevens 

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/emarketingstrategy

Please follow E.B. Moss and Insider Interviews on:

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If you found this helpful, or liked any of my Insider Interviews episodes, please add a review  on Apple, share this episode, and of course to support this show you can “buy me a coffee!”: https://buymeacoffee.com/mossappeal
If I can help you connect YOUR podcast/tv/content dots, or just get started with a good #b2b podcast, please reach out to me at podcasts@mossappeal.com

Jennifer Grimson On Building Wealth – and a Podcast



Jennifer Grimson was brand new to the podcast space when I met her two years ago at the last in-person Podcast Movement event. Fast forward and she became my spontaneous guest for Epi 34 of Insider Interviews discussing her approach to marketing the now successful Micro-Empires Podcast about her path to rebuilding wealth. And, since podcasting adds such a personal touch, she gives us insights about her very personal story from filing for Chapter 13 twice to being having million-dollar + in assets.

Grimson explains how she taught herself to rebuild her wealth AND how to build a podcast starting at any point in your life. “I’m living proof of that story…I lost everything. No home, no job, no car, no money, no place to live, and two children to raise. That happened to me twice…and the second time I was 41 years old.”

Her A-Ha Moment:

“I realized that if I wanted security and to build wealth, it wasn’t just going to be through one thing,” Grimson explained. “I was going to have to create little pockets, which I call ’empires’. And once I got started I was able to create $1.4 million in income producing assets in four years.”

Moving Past the Shame

“The podcast came about because people kept asking me about how I’d done that; of course I’d kept my story a secret because I was so ashamed of it, like a lot of people who share my story. I wanted to share what I had done, but more importantly, sharing those tools and real steps for anybody to take, whether it’s their mindset or literally taking steps to build wealth.”

Lessons Learned:

“I think the first lesson is you don’t abandon yourself, which is such a powerful thing. Think about it: I treat my friends and family better than I treat myself. I don’t say things to other people that I say inside my head. And I think that’s true all around. So finding a way, whether you believe it or not, whether you think you deserve it or not, of believing in yourself. … I just had to put blinders on and move forward … It’s not actually rocket science. It might be hard. But it’s not difficult to understand.”

After Grimson explained her three lessons of coming from nothing to financial resolution — assess, ask, act — she went on to explain how learning to be a podcaster — or learning ANYTHING — is to dive in.

“You’re going to jump in a pool with a bunch of people that are Olympic swimmers. And you’re going to be in there with your floaties on just trying to keep your head above water, but there’re two things that are going to happen:  Number one, you cannot be in that environment and not learn. And number two, the experts are not going to let you drown. That’s true about wealthy. That’s true about everybody here at Podcast Movement. People who are successful, 99.9% of the time want to help.”

On Creating and Marketing a Podcast?

Grimson did not have a media background: “I didn’t even know how to plug in the microphone. I still struggle with that portion of it. But I’ve never really worried about that because there are those Olympic swimmers you can call. I’m never going to be the best at that. What I have to offer is my experience. So that’s what I wanted to focus on. What I learned was that despite the fact that there’s a million podcasts very few of them are actually successful and that they take work. They’re not easy. You have to commit and be really thoughtful about who you’re talking to.”

That is about the best lesson one can learn when diving in to podcasting.

Does her story have a happy ending? You bet. Right down to her pro-hockey husband, Stu. But it’s all because Grimson, who is fiercely independent, candid, and determined, keeps on swimming. Take a listen. We’ll surface all kinds of tips and inspiration. And like she says, please leave a review for Insider Interviews!

Footnotes: Follow Jennifer and MicroEmpires:


Please follow E.B. Moss and Insider Interviews on:

Twitter:
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@mossappeal

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If you found this helpful, or liked any of my Insider Interviews episodes, please add a review  on Apple, share this episode, and of course to support this show you can “buy me a coffee!”: https://buymeacoffee.com/mossappeal
If I can help you connect YOUR podcast/tv/content dots, or just get started with a good #b2b podcast, please reach out to me at podcasts@mossappeal.com

From Print to Podcasts and Back: Kathy Doyle of MacMillian



Kathy Doyle embodies the early bird that catches the worm. Early into her freshman year of college she aimed to give the commencement speech for her class in four years’ time. She got the honor — and forty-eight hours later was offered her first job in media. Then, as you’ll hear her describe in this episode, Doyle was part of the earliest team building out The Wall Street Journal Online (yes, I sing the dial up tones for her). Then, being an early riser, she started to listen to podcasts well before Serial was even a thing. And guess what? She was an early-stage employee on the podcast team of Macmillan Publishing.

The Macmillan division of morphed out of a prescient move to team up with Grammar Girl podcast phenom Mignon Fogarty – and quickly evolved into the Quick and Dirty Tips Network of short form helpful content. (Perhaps it’s fitting that Doyle’s career was launched with a speech.) Now, with the addition of a narrative network, their podcasts garner millions of monthly listens – and recently also scored an inaugural Ambie Award for their stunning show, Driving The Green Book.

Macmillan is the only one of the “big five” publishers with its own podcast network. As Doyle says, “It’s been our vision to serve our authors the best way possible. And audio emerging the way that it did certainly created an opportunity for us to use podcasting as best advantage whether that’s through an audio book excerpt or interviews or guest series…” In a media world where everyone is aiming to flow content cross platform it’s a surprising exclusive advantage. (As a matter of fact, we discuss the conference I’m producing for NATPE about the proliferation of TV brands leveraging podcasting, as well. Please register free to attend ContentCast on July 14th!)

While she provided many serious business takeaways, we also learned how one phone call, and frequent dog walking, helped lead to Doyle’s career success, and of the drama of “dial-up days” during early-stage internet jobs.

And you won’t believe what’s got Doyle’s gobsmacked about podcasting these days (yes, I checked the spelling, Grammar Girl fans out there): the evolution of the host read ad. I know, I wasn’t expecting that answer either. But you’ll appreciate how she illustrates the issue with an example from a men’s underwear advertiser.

In all seriousness, host read ads are a major topic in the business of podcasting as we balance the goal for perceived alignment with an influential personality with personalization enabled by companies like A Million Ads or Frequency. (Note: I’ll discuss the power of influencers in the upcoming Epi 32 with Danielle Wiley of Sway.)

For Doyle, the learning was about balance: how to deliver a strong response while preserving the integrity of hosts and authors. But another balancing act is tied to revenue and the competition for ears and ad dollars.

Another business consideration is discoverability. That’s where Doyle and team did a wide scale collaboration with Apple for the notable Driving the Green Book. Hear how they did, in fact, leverage cross-platform promotion in innovative ways – from reading lists to playlists. (Note: Hear show producer Juleyka Lantigua Williams on this from Episode 12 of Insider Interviews.)

“I think it keeps a lot of us in this industry up at night. We talk about revenue diversification a lot. In fact, I just did a panel for Digital Hollywood on revenue diversification. …You can’t just rely on the ad model anymore. You have to find new ways — like exploiting a podcast into a book or a film and TV. I think it’s going to be fascinating to see how podcasters leverage new tools that are available now through Spotify and apple, which have been available through Stitcher and Luminary, to be strategic about your content and then finding ways to expand and enhance that through a premium subscription. I think three or four years ago, I would’ve said absolutely not, but now I think there’s probably opportunity for that.”

“As people expand their listening and really become hooked on some shows that have that have a big ad load then spending a few bucks for a premium subscription to eliminate that might be very attractive.”

(This was where I noted that you can support THIS podcast and just “buy me a coffee”. Just sayin’ …. )

But don’t worry; there was more: Doyle also prognosticated on the future of consolidation in podcasting…and shared some of her favorite shows these days. So, make like that early bird, and catch all of Doyle’s words. You’ll be ahead of the curve.

More about Macmillan Podcasts: https://linktr.ee/macmillanpodcasts
Kathy Doyle on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kdoyle2/
If you found this helpful, or liked any of my Insider Interviews episodes, please add a review on apple, share this episode, and of course, “buy me a coffee!”: https://buymeacoffee.com/mossappeal
If I can help you connect YOUR podcast/tv/content dots, or just get started, please reach out to me at podcasts@mossappeal.com

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Talking Business…and Podcasting…and Content! With Ken Kraetzer



For this quick but special episode of Insider Interviews I was in the guest seat! In highlights from my appearance on Ken Kraetzer’s show, “Talking Business” for CBSI, Ken interviewed ME to get my recommendations about how businesses can get in to the world of podcasting, best ways to leverage social media — and social audio — and why it’s key to create content across all platforms.

You’ll understand in just a few minutes how it all comes together for the show I’m producing for trade association, NATPE — their first-ever conference on the intersection of TV and Podcasting! (I’m very proud of this project and working hard to create a chock-full of takeaways agenda for content creators, marketers and producers across both screens.)

Ken also got a little bit of my life story — at least my career path, as well as a story about the good-news/bad-news of tech, when I recently confused a “Zoom friend” with an “IRL” friend!

You can catch the FULL VIDEO of my interview with Ken on YouTube where we also discuss social audio and social media best practices! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6PU_IDU9iA&t=27s

Here are some links to topics discussed:

NATPE’s July 14th “ContentCast” Conference 

David Berkowitz’s Serial Marketers (Start with the newsletter. You’ll thank me.)

Erica Keswin on Rituals (Of course I’m going to point you to my podcast episode with her!)

Susan McPherson’s book, The Lost Art of Connecting

And check out PodcastMovement (I’ll be doing a virtual preso at the August event on B2B podcasting, but read their daily newsletter for great scoop.
If you found this helpful, or liked any of my Insider Interviews episodes, feel free to “buy me a coffee!”: https://buymeacoffee.com/mossappeal
If I can help you connect YOUR podcast/tv/content dots, or just get started, please reach out to me at podcasts@mossappeal.com

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@mossappeal

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