Tag Archives: measurement

Five Podcast Pros Offer the Insider Scoop



In a spontaneous episode I discussed five different aspects of the business of podcasting – from using AI to “audio or video?”, to leveraging the star power and engagement power of podcasting.

You’ll hear from:

  • Michael Kaye, Director of Brand & Communications for OkCupid, an online dating app;
  • Brandon Reed, Host, formerly tired dad, and creator of 12 Hour Sound Machines, a viral podcast that helps people sleep;
  • Bona Rai, COO and Co-founder of Capsho, the tool that helped E.B. use AI to generate these very show notes (!);
  • Chris Whitman, Co-founder and Chief Strategy Officer of GlassBox Media, think ‘music label-meets-podcast marketing machine’; 
  • A.J. Feliciano, Head of The Roost Podcast Network from Warner Bros Discovery, that started the groundswell of podcasts leveraging video and has his finger on the pulse of monetizing best practices to meet the consumer where they’re consuming content.

 It’s five inspiring chats that reveal the brilliant possibilities of audio and video for the future including:

  1. How OkCupid leverages podcasting for success – earned or owned?
  2. The business model behind the 12 Hour Sound Machines podcast
  3. What Capsho is, and how this new tool taps AI to help podcasters save time
  4. How GlassBox Media cracks the code on growing podcast awareness and ups the value of creator IP

    A spontaneous interview at the Sounds Profitable event in Austin
  5. When is a podcast a video and a video a podcast? How should brands embrace the consumer’s content journey? The Roost tells all.

Chapter Summaries/Time Codes:

[00:00:01]

This is episode 5 of Insider Interviews, with five different guests included. Each of my guests spoke about a different area of the business of podcasting. This was recorded spontaneously right after a panel I conducted during SXSW for Sounds Profitable, featuring one of the panelists and four members of the audio ….

[00:01:42]

Michael Kaye, director of communications at OkCupid is naturally inclined towards earned, but says: “We’ve seen tremendous impact from both podcast advertising and from earned, pitching our experts to appear on other shows. In 2023, we’ll be looking again at podcast advertising.”

[00:03:57]

Brandon Reed’s podcast is called 12-Hour Sound Machines. It was created when his newborn couldn’t sleep through the night, now enjoying about 300,000 downloads a day. Reed started by first directly selling to brands, but now he’s on Megaphone, in the Spotify Audience Network so programmatic sales is a really good solution for him. Hear his explanation of why the moments before falling asleep are actually a powerful moment for advertisers….

[00:09:12]

Bona Rai is a co-founder of Capsho, a product that uses AI to tap audio files to create SEO-optimized content for podcasts. At just 10 months old they’re already embracing a more robust version of Capsho 2.0 coming this Spring.

[Note: I tried out Capsho 1.0 for most of these show notes, with an added “human touch!”]

[00:14:15]

Chris Whitman describes GlassBox Media like a record label for podcast hosts. Its goal is to grow the value of the IP for the creators across any sort of opportunity from a revenue perspective. “Now we represent around 65 shows, with no end in sight.”

[00:18:58]

A.J. Feliciano explains that The Roost podcast network is a video-first podcast network. “We have about 90 shows, a third of them are owned and operated. What is it about multiplatform distribution on podcasts that makes it so worthwhile for other podcasters?”

[00:21:18]

Our thinking around YouTube is that it’s less that it’s about video, and more about the platform itself. Who’s your target audience and where have they been conditioned to go to just consume content? And that’s why we’re seeing podcast-like content bringing such big numbers there.

[00:23:54]

The Roost podcast will always have a foundation in audio. It can have video, it can be on YouTube. Heck, we might even see a world a year or two where long form content is being distributed on TikTok.

[00:24:44]

In terms of measurement A.J. says, “A view and a download are counted two separate metrics: A view is :30 seconds of playback on YouTube and then audio download is :60 seconds by unique user. It’s still very much early days and we’re going to have to figure out ways to plug into that back end of YouTube API.” Adding, “We need to properly measure and communicate those returns for the advertising community.

What’s the reason why podcasting is so big today? It’s because Direct Response has used it as their primary tool. There’s money to be had –and we can do a lot better on this front.

[00:27:50]

One of the things that’s helped us build our business is looking beyond the podcast. If you want to properly tackle YouTube and TikTok and other new platforms that will inevitably join the fray into the future, we really have to almost take the “podcast” out of the center of our universe.

The theme music for Insider Interviews was composed and performed by the incomparable Grammy-winning John Clayton, and this episode was edited by Grace Morton.
Send questions or a suggestion for a next stellar guest to:  podcasts@mossappeal.com

Catch all Insider Interviews episodes on the business of #media, #marketing and advertising right here, or wherever you like to listen to #b2b podcasts. 

Connect with our Episode 5 guests here:

Michael Kaye

Brandon Reed

Bona Rai

Chris Whitman –

A.J. Feliciano

Connect with Insider Interviews:

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Westwood One’s Pierre Bouvard on Making Good Audio Impressions



Pierre Bouvard has some words of wisdom for media buyers out there…if you’re not buying audio (yes, all audio), you’re leaving reach and engagement on the table. As Chief Insights Officer at Cumulus Media/Westwood One, Pierre has seen the proof and has busted the myths surrounding audio advertising—and particularly the misconceptions about AM/FM radio.

“Radio is perceived as much smaller than it really is. But the data tells us that ad-supported AM-FM streaming is actually bigger than ad-supported Pandora and Spotify combined. That blows people away.”

After stints at Coleman Insights and TiVo, he has become the audio industry’s most revered evangelist and research mind. Now leading Westwood One’s full-service advisory—the Audio Active Group—he provides advertisers with media planning recommendations, creative best practices, and measurement services.

This episode will certainly delight the research aficionados—and may just convince the audio skeptics. We also dig into:

  • What we mean when we say ‘audio.’ Pierre breaks down the composition of the entire audio universe.
  • Tactical scoop about media planning tactics and why an omnichannel approach works best.
  • What the heck is ‘eyes on glass’ and what does it tell us about the effectiveness of TV?
  • Pierre’s pragmatic POV on brand purpose reminds brands to go back to basics.
  • While he does a lot of work recommending media, he drops some facts on why creative trumps everything.
  • Why it’s time for advertisers to stop testing and start committing budgets to podcast advertising. (Learn about the “5% rule”!)

Plus, hear the story of how Pierre ‘broke the internet’ and E.B.’s voice impression of Bette Midler… Just sayin’.

This was a fun (and extremely informative) conversation. I hope this inspires you to learn more about the power of audio advertising.

Mentioned in this episode:

Dig into these findings on sonic branding

Check out the Audio Active blog from Westwood One

Learn more about Edison’s Share of Ear. 

Find Pierre on LinkedIn and on Twitter

Follow Insider Interviews and Moss Appeal on:

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IG: @insiderinterviews and @mossappeal  

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and 
PINTEREST because, yes, it’s a thing!

LinkedIn: https://linkedin.com/in/mossappeal  

Hat tip to Annie Hunt for great show notes and social media support!
And, please support this free podcast Insider Interviews at buymeacoffee.com/mossappeal
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Please support Insider Interviews at www.buymeacoffee.com/mossappeal

How Elevator Advertising Survived 2021’s Ups and Downs



Marc Kidd, CEO of Captivate, lost sleep thinking about the lost foot traffic in office buildings when the pandemic hit. After all, his company specializes in programming the video screens in elevators. But, this son of famed NCAA football coach, Roy Kidd (as in Roy Kidd Stadium), is not one to panic at fourth down.  In our conversation for Epi 43 he shared how Captivate evolved its Digital Out of Home (DOOH) offerings to include home and play locations, with an upswing in results for sales and marketers alike.

“There was a high stakes game on a really bad weather day and I said, ‘Dad, it’s raining, the wind’s blowing. What decision are you going to make about the coin toss?’ He said, ‘You don’t worry about the things you can’t control.’ It has always reminded me that there are things in life you have no control over … like a pandemic.”

Marc is not a stranger to having to pivot. Hear what happened when his college plans to work alongside his dad got waylaid… and he briefly considered accounting for a career! Luckily, he found his footing in sports marketing…then broadcasting, giving him the foundation for a storied career that included helping create the NCAA corporate partner program and the Breeders Cup’s World Thoroughbred Championships, WAC corporate partner programs and iHigh.com.
Now at Captivate, he had some tough calls to make in the past two years for the greater good, but like all boats when the tide rises he ultimately helped the elevator advertising business stay the course through more innovation.
sample from Captivate elevator content
Sample image from Captivate screen content
Listen and learn about:
  • How Captivate transfigured awkward social spaces!
  • The evolution of DOOH (Digital Out of Home) itself and its use in brand and awareness marketing
  • The guiding path to advertising effectiveness and strategizing content
  • QR codes and other ways of building real attribution
  • How COVID-19 disruption prompted forward-thinking repositioning
  • Captivate’s 2022 plans, including re-engineered programmatic platforms
  • Staying in the game by evolving through crisis
    CaptivateScan – a pandemic-inspired innovation for building lobbies
  • Why Marc can twirl a baton!…
Attribution Tactic Resources mentioned:
GroundTruth
Office Pulse
Placed Foursquare
Kochava

Social Media Links:

Please share the podcast if you liked this episode, and follow Insider Interviews on Twitter, Instagram, and Facebook. And to support more please add to my virtual tip jar!  https://www.buymeacoffee.com/mossappeal

You can also reach out to be considered for an episode — or suggest questions or a guest — or to have your own bespoke podcast series produced and/or hosted by E.B. Moss. Email us at podcasts@mossappeal.com. We’re “hear” for you!


Cadillac CMO Melissa Grady Dias on Marketing a Maverick (with heart)



A milestone! It’s Episode 40 of Insider Interviews! And for that, who better to interview than Cadillac’s Global Chief Marketing Officer, Melissa Grady Dias, who is, herself, marketing a milestone: the launch of what will be the first all electric line of luxury brand vehicles (EVs), starting with the Lyriq!

This episode was recorded in September, and since then the new Lyriq has sold out of pre-sale reservations. So how did it get so popular? Why is Cadillac “the maverick” of the GM brands, and how does its marketing deliver on its corporate parent’s promise to be the most inclusive company in the world?

For the past two years, Melissa Grady Dias has held the key. She is a marketer’s marketer, a master of math and of insight-driven creative. With a heart. That “brand and demand” combo (as I’ll write more about in The Continuum) is what’s helped infuse those corporate cause-oriented values into everything from gaming tie-ins to 6-second ads, to experiential marketing with Michelin-rated chefs. To hear Melissa be moved by the definition of equity and inclusion is to understand what “drives” (sorry) much of the brand messaging, but messaging that is always backed by data.
As she explains:

“I try to understand how and where my audience is consuming media, and how they’re entertaining themselves. Then I try to be in those places, but to do it in a different way, so that it really breaks through.”

While always in pursuit of an advertising career, (“I used to watch Who’s the Boss and I loved Angela and I wanted to be like her,” she confesses) Melissa almost took a wrong turn. But discovering Database, Direct, and e-Commerce studies in a Masters program led her to expertise in performance marketing and technology. Her passion for good creative added the rest of the fuel.
After discussing how she “followed her career north star to OnStar” we took some deep dives into how she is marketing the 125-year old brand, including:
  • What it means to “show up differently” and how the Cadillac marketing team approaches the funnel differently, too (hint: upside down!)
  • With GM looking to go all EV and towards a 0, 0, 0 world (zero emissions, zero crashes, and zero congestion) how Cadillac, historically an innovator brand, is at the forefront of that effort:
  • Just why Cadillac overall — from the Escalade to the XT6 — is like the maverick of GM brands, while still infused with corporate cause-oriented values.

“Cadillac is also a bit of a maverick and we’ve always stood for those people who really have big dreams and bold ambitions, but really they’re the change-makers.”

  • Melissa’s reaction to CEO Mary Barra’s statement on making GM one of the most inclusive companies in the world, and how they’re doing that — on social, in a campaign or in how they’re spending money;

“Equity is treating everyone the same and fairly. So if there’s a dance everyone’s invited to the dance. Inclusion is being asked to dance.”

  • Campaign development:

“When Regina King heard the brand manifesto, she could relate it to her story. And …it inspires me to be a better person, too. That’s how the “Never Stop Arriving” campaign was born: it’s about hitting a moment, celebrating yourself and then thinking ‘Now, how do I keep making the world better? How am I going to keep moving forward?’”

  • How they identify prospects and find them, starting with addressable and digital then filling in as they go up the funnel, right to tentpole events like their Oscars™ or PGA sponsorships;
  • Melissa’s perspective on audience demographics “I’m never saying, ‘where are the 25-54 year olds with a certain income’” and feelings about linear TV to podcasts…even their innovative use of gaming and AR and VR as part of the sales process;

(Note – Take a look at Cadillac Live for a unique view of how vehicles can be experienced in our showroom and supply-chain challenged times! And fun fact: More test drives happen on YouTube than in a car dealership! So hear how Cadillac Live deployed a takeover with a “first” on the video site!)

  • Hear how data is handled and respected and leveraged;
  • How experiential comes to life in unexpected ways, like finding inspiration in the Lyriq grill for food recipes!;
  • How future CMOs can follow a similar path to success? Melissa shares a three-point plan of action which, of course, starts with follow your passion.

Finally, hear why my heart was pounding – as with most people who experience Super Cruise for the first time – but in my case just from watching their effective long-form celebrity videos about the hands-free driving option! Melissa has described this as the “let go” moment.

As voiced by Tiffany Haddish in the video, “Sometimes you gotta grab the wheel and sometimes you just have to let it go.” It’s trust that you’ll get where you need to be. Melissa, who makes it a point to meditate daily, thinks her personal mantra – ‘I’m exactly where I’m supposed to be’ – “ties into that idea pretty well.”

Easter Egg Moment: Insider Interviews aims to give you the “insider scoop” on media, marketing and advertising, along with the personal side of execs. And you’ll catch a very human moment around 20 minutes in…. But do enjoy all 40 minutes of this informative and jam packed conversation!
If you found this helpful, feel free to help support ANOTHER 40 episodes of Insider Interviews and add to my virtual tip jar to buy me a coffee“: https://buymeacoffee.com/mossappeal
And please support us with a review wherever you listen, share this episode. Or allow me to help you get started with a podcast or content marketing strategy: podcasts@mossappeal.com.

Follow Cadillac:

  • Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/cadillac
  • Twitter: https://twitter.com/Cadillac

Connect with E.B. Moss and Insider Interviews at Moss Appeal and on:

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THANK YOU for listening!

E.B.

 


Ruth Stevens: No BS About B2B Marketing



Today’s episode could be a lesson plan about B2B Marketing because my guest, Ruth Stevens, has been teaching business to business marketing at NYU, Columbia, and B-schools around the world. And that’s in between being one of the foremost consultants in the space. So, Stevens calls BS on certain approaches to B2B we all better sit up and listen. Hear about the “fails” AND the best practices for what makes customers sit up and listen, too!

Stevens went right from business school herself to TimeWarner’s Book of the Month division, “thinking that I was joining one of the great book marketing companies in the world. I learned I was actually in one of the great direct marketing companies in the world.” After seven years of getting schooled in DM she mastered B2B first at Ziff Davis then IBM, simultaneously writing columns as well as teaching others at night.

In one example of her “no BS advice” articles, which appear everywhere from Biznology.com to HBR.org, Stevens says, “Don’t Be a Jerk on LinkedIn”, and advises sellers everywhere not to jump to the pitch. (“Building relationships on social media is hard. People get lazy and go straight to being the seller, and skip the personal establishment part. They’re also just sorely tempted by how easy it is to just make a mass pitch using LinkedIn Sales Navigator.”)

And, heed Stevens when she notes:

Today the ability of the salesperson to guide a purchase in their direction, but also to understand more deeply the needs of the buyer, has been eroded. So the marketer needs to step in and provide the educational content. This has driven the huge rise of B2B content marketing to allow that researcher better understanding of how to solve a problem or how your solution can be helpful, and to guide them toward calling you.

Companies’ approach to client retention is also in need of schooling:

Another area where I see B2B companies failing, or sub-optimizing, is retention marketing and it just drives me crazy because this is where the bulk of profits arise. Most companies organize it to be the responsibility of someone called ‘account management’, which is an important function, but marketing is not being asked to support it.

Stevens feels for the challenges faced by marketers and sellers these days in getting to know or reach know the buyer and ever-expanding buying groups — especially in enterprise purchasing:

Marketers need to try to replicate that old relationship building aspect by identifying the members of the buying circle and either find out through outbound calling, for example, or social listening, or infer what their agendas are, because each member of the buying circle usually has a different agenda, different need. And then try to serve those needs on a one-to-one basis. And despite all of our wonderful MarTech and data, it’s really hard to do.

That’s also why events (especially virtual events) have taken on an even larger role — as a place researchers can get their questions answered. So, Stevens points out, we need to be even more active at business events than before, and to create our own opportunities, webinars and meetings to build those now more elusive business and sales relationships.

The trick there, as with everywhere, as you’ll hear in this episode, is how one shows up at those events or in that content. No pants on a Zoom aside, business presence still needs panache and empathy.

You’ll hear many tips and lessons from “Professor Stevens” in this episode, including:
  • How creative still needs to be about education, but in a context that captures attention and builds trust.
  • How and why we stumble when we try to apply traditional consumer creative strategies to B2B and risk sounding “tinny or irrelevant” — but why storytelling is still a “watchword” for B2B.
  • Why it’s wrong for the brand power to be measured by if it helps the salesperson get a meeting: “Asking marketers to base their entire value proposition to the firm on sales results unfairly puts the sales piece of the puzzle into the marketer’s metrics kit. If the marketers are handing good quality leads and generating interest and a perception of value in the marketplace, and the sales team can’t close the deal, then marketing shouldn’t be taking the hit for that… We need other metrics to help marketers understand what they’re delivering and help management.”
  • And, since Stevens also wrote the book on data-driven marketing (literally) she suggests looking at such metrics as cost per lead, or cost for qualified lead. While lead-to-sales conversion rate shouldn’t be marketing’s, “we need an awareness metric. Or maybe a trust metric, that can credit marketing with all of the earlier pre-lead stuff.”
  • Why the goal of B2B marketing is to communicate that “We are experts in the problem that you have, and you can trust us to help you solve the problem”, but needs to get that across without saying as much and still creating an emotional connection even though you’re buying for business purposes.”

Hey, her words, not mine, but: “this is why the B2B agency function exists in the world because they know what they’re doing and they can come up with messaging strategies that grab attention and deliver the message and in a way that makes sense to the business buyer.”

Finally, as I’m also Editor of The Continuum, a publication about brand and demand marketing, I had to ask if there’s a difference in awareness and performance marketing for B2B vs. B2C. The professorial answer?

“No, it’s the same concept: you need brand and demand for both B2B and B2C, but down on the ground, we’re talking about a very different buying process: B2B is more complicated. It’s longer. It involves more individuals, all of whom have to be engaged with and influenced… such as when it comes to raw materials, professional services, technology, and other business process oriented purchasing, which typically involve a large number of people. So the whole sales and marketing function needs to support that.”

Please find and follow Ruth Stevens for B2B help without the BS:

LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/ruthstevens

Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/RuthPStevens 

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/emarketingstrategy

Please follow E.B. Moss and Insider Interviews on:

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If I can help you connect YOUR podcast/tv/content dots, or just get started with a good #b2b podcast, please reach out to me at podcasts@mossappeal.com

The Rise and Rise of Bryan and Ryan: Podcast Entrepreneurs



Bryan Barletta of Sounds Profitable is known for being a guy that explains complicated podcasting ad-tech in a helpful, generous way. Ryan Rose of JoneKiri is an up-and-comer in the industry who has already made a mark by helping talent communicate across multiple platforms. Both started in podcasting. Both quit their day-jobs in podcasting mid-pandemic (!) to launch their own businesses. And both are succeeding wildly.

In this conversation they discuss with host E.B. Moss everything from how advertisers can go beyond traditional podcast ad exposure and pricing, to the implications of a “cookie-less world” to the better mousetrap of content marketing cross screen*. These are smart young turks who share a lot of wisdom.
We discuss:
  • How Bryan went from McDonalds to History Major to a major force in the developer space before landing in podcasting…and starting Sounds Profitable
  • Why this quote from his recent newsletter post sums up Bryan’s mission…and value:

When buyers have a hard time translating tools, metrics, and services between advertising channels we get friction, and friction prohibits more buyers from choosing podcast advertising as a viable channel. But that friction can be soothed with education.

  • How slowing down to focus on that education in the business can help speed up revenue
  • Why Megaphone, Advertisecast and Podcorn got snapped up…
  • And why HotPod and PodNews are read voraciously…
  • The imperative for diverse podcasters and the effort to support them by, e.g., former Insider Interviews guest, Juleyka Lantigua-Williams
  • Our “surprise mystery guest”, Ryan Rose makes his entrance and explains the what (and pronunciation!) of JoneKiri (hint: discipline and passion…)
  • The opportunity for talent to help offer presence across podcasting + + +…all screens!
  • Why a “cookie-less world” is not such a bad thing…especially in the podcasting world. (Guess who answered THAT one?!)
  • Why Bryan thinks Ryan “fits into a category of people that I think are going to be the next and hottest things in the next two years in podcasting” and why Ryan thinks beyond the pre- or mid-roll, and in fact staked his current career on it
  • The world beyond the CPM or CPA
  • Why they think I’m great. (Kind of love that.)

There’s a lot more. These are smart guys. You’ll want to listen. Again. And maybe again.

You can find Bryan on Twitter and https://soundsprofitable.com/

And Ryan and JoneKiri are on LinkedIn

If you found THESE tips valuable from Bryan and Ryan, I don’t mind if you virtually tip ME, and “buy me a coffee“! ( https://www.buymeacoffee.com/mossappeal ).

Please let me know if you have a topic or suggestion for a future episode on the business of media, marketing and advertising — or need help creating or marketing your own B2B podcast! *Stay tuned for big news — or ping me — about an upcoming conference I’m coordinating on the intersection of podcasting and all OTHER content screens!  Podcasts@mossappeal.com

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PS: This episode publishes on #EarthDay2021, so please also check out Epi 28 for all the good that Sustainable Brands has been doing since 2006.